Spirituality

A space for the inevitable off-topic discussions.

Postby zekoalives » Sun Jun 26, 2011 8:27 am

Shadowscale wrote:
Underdog10 wrote:I AGREE WITH THAT ONE GUY! THOSE OTHER GUYS ARE WAY OUT OF LINE!

Woah, I thought Underdog10 left the forum to go cry about his lost thread... times be changing.
Nah...
... only imagining things...
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Postby Killosk » Sun Jun 26, 2011 12:41 pm

Everything is fake.
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Postby Folfness » Sun Jun 26, 2011 3:53 pm

*kindly asks* that we ignore thread. so it can die like bennie put.
Please don't chew, that hurts. >.<
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Postby Wolfman-Al » Sun Jun 26, 2011 4:11 pm

Killosk wrote:Everything is fake.

You know, you do have a point there.
How do we know that anything exists? All sensory impressions, vision, hearing, sense of smell, sense of touch, sense of taste are nothing but electric impulses that reach our brain, impulses that can be manipulated or even simulated, all we see, hear, feel, smell, taste and touch could be fake and we would never know. All I know for sure is that I exist because my consciousness is able to form these thoughts. Cogito ergo sum. BUT! Those thoughts are also nothing but electric impulses. Which, as previously said, can be simulated. So there is even a possibility that I don´t exist, which would be in contradiction to my conclusion that I exist because of my ability to form those very thoughts. Then there is the possibility that I exist while I don´t exist, that existence itself is a paradox.
Then again, as Sokrates said, οἶδα οá½
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Postby Daithean » Sun Jun 26, 2011 4:25 pm

Descartes was arguing that because everything could be reduced to nothing because all data could be falsified, actually putting that into practice is a bit stupid so the logical start point is that the self does exist as to you, this is undeniable. It is undeniable because the situation you write about assumes an exterior reality in which to falsify your illusory sense of self, and when a sense of self feels real, it is real, as that's the only criteria required for a sense of self to exist. It can be an artificially created sense of self, but it's still a sense of self. Nutrients can be artificially created but they're still nutritious.

When the illusion is a complete illusion, a coherent one, then ignoring it is stupid.
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Postby Wolfman-Al » Sun Jun 26, 2011 5:32 pm

Daithean wrote:Descartes was arguing that because everything could be reduced to nothing because all data could be falsified, actually putting that into practice is a bit stupid so the logical start point is that the self does exist as to you, this is undeniable. It is undeniable because the situation you write about assumes an exterior reality in which to falsify your illusory sense of self, and when a sense of self feels real, it is real, as that's the only criteria required for a sense of self to exist. It can be an artificially created sense of self, but it's still a sense of self. Nutrients can be artificially created but they're still nutritious.

When the illusion is a complete illusion, a coherent one, then ignoring it is stupid.

Now that was the paradox I was talking about. An artifical sense of self is not real but at the same time it is "real enough" to allow such conclusions. Still it would always still be an imitation, a fraud, not existing on its own account. Which brings me to the next question: on WHOSE account would it exist then? Or let me form the question different, who would have any use of a artifical sense of self in a simulated universe? A sciencist making an experiment on a computer with A.I.? God? What if your entire existence is nothing but an idea within a larger conscience? A brief thougth, there in one second, forgotten in the next?
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